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Nicole Jess - Is UX the remedy for Ethical Fading at the clinical interface?

Nicole Jess - Is UX the remedy for Ethical Fading at the clinical interface?

Designing for the Healthcare sector is complex and challenging. An intricate knowledge of the healthcare structure does little to reveal the authentic experiences of those hardened by years of exposure to second victim trauma and empty promises from leaders within the sector. How can UX find the truth of the voices within the sector and undo the effects of ethical fading at the clinical interface?

This presentation will define ethical fading, demonstrate its insidious presence in healthcare and how UX can help stop it in its tracks!

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uxaustralia
PRO

May 03, 2022
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  1. N e ha hi i a edi ed a c

    i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i . www captionslive com au | captionslive outlook com | UX A a a W e UX S cceed De T e da , 26 A 2022 Ca i ed b : Be ade e McG ld ick
  2. N e ha hi i a edi ed a c

    i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i . Page 34 >> COVID- afe De l, a b d ! The imi g! S , e e b d . D e ' belie e i ' me. MAGS HANLEY: We ha e Nic le Je . I hi k he g ea hi g ha e' e ee i e' e had Ja a i alki g ab he j e ... (I di i c ) a d a ki g a d (i di i c ). NICOLE JESS: Tha k m ch. >> The e e g . See ha I did? S m ch! NICOLE JESS: S , g d m i g, e e e. Tha k f c mi g. M ame i Nic le Je a d I'm g a alk da ab he cli ical i e face. Bef e I d , I ld like di e i he defi i i a d c m e f hi , I ld j like alk a li le bi ab he heal hca e ace a d ha i ' like de ig i g f ha ec . S me f ma be ki g i ha ace. S me ma . A d me ma ha e ab l el i e e i he heal hca e ace a all. B he i e e i g hi g i ha all f , ma e he e e i ha ec m f i e e a d e gageme , e' e all e gaged affec ed b he heal hca e ec i e a a he . S , i h ha i mi d, le ' c ide hi . Y ' e i h i al a d ' e i he bed a d i ' , i ' he I ha ' he e, ha i g ha e e ie ce. S , he e l ki g af e ma be Ve ica Sam i he bed, a d he e i ma age , bed fi e, h ' j hed e he c id a , "Y bed..." T a ie e ice , ' e a blic i a e a ie . A d he l cal, a e a i al heal h, ' e a c me f heal hca e e ice . S , i hi ha e em, a e e ha bec me a mbe f diffe e hi g , a d b ha e d i f c me , ' e
  3. N e ha hi i a edi ed a c

    i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i . Page 35 e e iall a facele , amele e e e a i f he i a i . S , he e hi k ab ha , e eed c ide ha ac ha c m e f bec mi g amele , i eall e hi a ea f deci i be made ha a e ba ed a h ma e e ie ce, e e iall . The ' e ba ed a mbe a d dem g a hic. A d ha ' he e e hical fadi g ca c me i la . S , h, le me g f a d he e. He e e g . S , if e l k a e hical fadi g i elf, i ' i e el i e i b h defi i i a d b e a i . S , he e defi i i ki d f fl de a d a cia i a d c me f e hical fadi g, i ' m im l de c ibed a he ac f a ga i a i i de ed ce he im ac he e e f e e i i he deci i a cia ed i h ha e he e le i ha e e . Pe all , e hical fadi g i m f e e l b e ed a e ma ageme ig i g he lea f cli icia h a e he cli ical i e face. The e a e cli icia ha a e eall im l leadi g f e ce a d e ice ha all hem c m le e hei j b effec i el . A d f e he ea ha he ' e ided i h h e e ce i d e c eme c ac a d b dge , a d hi g ha d ' eall fac i ha i di id al e e ie ce ha he cli icia i face- -face i h. S , I' e e e ie ced ha fi ha d a d I' e al a ched a cli icia ha e ake i hem el e e c me h e defici . I' e ee aff call h i al ge e ce , call ha macie ge medica i , call l cal e ge a ie f e a al a d . A d i ' ama i g ee h aff ill g ab e a d be d c m e a e f hi g , f deci i ha a e bei g made ide ha c e. S , i i m e e ie ce f e hical fadi g fi ha d ha eall d e me m e i UX. I ha cli ical ace, i ' i c edibl ha d c ea e cha ge a d i ' i c edibl ha d ha e ha ice hea d, a d ha ' ha eall d e me i bec mi g a UX e ea che a d f c i g he heal hca e ace. S , if e l k... Oh, , le me j g back e. If e di e i
  4. N e ha hi i a edi ed a c

    i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i . Page 36 he c ce f e hical fadi g a li le bi f he , e hical fadi g i elf ha hi di a ci g effec ha ki d f ac like a b ffe be ee he igh a d g f a i a i . A d i ac di e e i di id al ' e ibili , i l eme i ela i ha e e , ecificall he ega i e c me . A d i cc a a ga i a i al le el. S , i e e iall ha g e e ha c ci l a e i di id al i hi h e e le el i hi ha g , he ag ee ce ai a da d i de mee a g al, a b i e g al. S , if e' e l ki g he heal hca e ec , e hical fadi g i f e e e ie ced b he blic a cli ical e ice , ha ma be e ce i e ai ime , i ma be e le bei g di cha ged l g bef e he ' e ac all ead - a d he e e e c ea e a l f e a d a ie f he a ie hem el e a d hei l ed e . F ac al cli ical aff, i ca l k like afe affi g, i fficie a i - like, cli icia - - a ie a i , lack f e ce , e ce i e e ime. A d ac ice ha a e gge ed cli icia ha ac all g agai lic a d f e c mm e e. S , if e m e e f he i he cli ical e i g a d ha e ha ela i hi be ee he cli icia a d he a ie , i ' a m ch cl e di a ce, he e' le h ical, ch l gical di a ce be ee h e i di id al . B i hi ha ace, a le e deg ee f e hical fadi g ca ag ee, a d ha ' called e gageme . A d he l e le el f e hical fadi g a he i di id al le el ha h ee c m e , hich i ch l gical mbi g, elf- e ce i , a d he he ' e b h add e ed, e l i g i di e gageme . S , if e l k i h e a li le bi m e. S , ch l gical mbi g i a eflec i e e e ha cc a a ec i e mecha i m f e i e e e ea ed e e e f l a d a ma ic e e . A e am le f hi ma be a cli icia h c a l ee a a ie i di e b i able ac all ac e l e ha di e . S , gi e he a e f cli ical k, ca de a d h hi migh a de el i e ea l i a g
  5. N e ha hi i a edi ed a c

    i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i . Page 37 cli icia ' ca ee , a i ac a a ki d f b ffe i g ha em a hic ai ha ca c me i ha i a i . A d hi lead h gh elf-dece i . I ' a ce b hich e a de el e a a i e ha c ea e hi ki d f b a f he e hical c m e f a i a i , a d he k ki d f di g i e he m al im lica i f deci i . Thi e e iall all deci i ha a e ed mi a l ki d f - he ' e f c ed ki d f elf- e e a i f m he cli icia ide f hi g , b he ca a ea elf-i e e ed. F e am le, if e hi k ha ab cli icia ha ' able e l e he e al di e f he i e a d he ' e ee hi e a d e , hi ma begi c ea e a i ha cli icia ' mi d he e he decei e hem el e i h he i ha hi a ie i i m all ca i a d he ' e ai i g be a fe ed a he a d a a . S , hi e a a i e a ha ac all ki d f di c ec hem f m hi e e f e ibili , ki d f a d he i a i , a d ha ca ki d f la i h a e like, "I ca ' hel he e beca e I'm al ead e a ie a a d he ' e ac all a ai i g a fe , ha ' he e d f m ki d f e gageme , m e ibili ." S , he e elf-dece i ca be ki d f mmed - I d ' k if a e... B he e' a b k called The S ie We Tell O el e I O de T Li e, a d ha ' he le ha elf-dece i la i he cli ical field. A I aid, add e ed ch l gical mbi g a d elf-dece i lead hi di e gageme f m mal a d c e i al e hical a da d , d e hi hif i he e e ie ce i elf be ha ed, hi aid ag eeme f hi e a a i e. S , h e e eali ie ha a e bei g c ea ed h gh he a a i e - k a m al di e gageme . S , hi migh l k like ha cli icia ha e' e alki g ab ha ca ' ac all add e he i di id al' ai . The ' e ki d f like, "The ' e bei g m ed a he a d a a , he ' e i hi m c e f ac ice," i ' hi ce f di e gagi g f m ha i a i a d mi imi i g he fac ha , ac all ,
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    i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i . Page 38 he e' a he h ma i ha ace ha ' ffe i g. A d i ' ha b ffe i g. S , he e e e iall f eg e e ibili ha he ha e i de ed ce hi ki d f e e f e gageme e e f e ibili beca e he ' e c me a i he e he ' e a ed feel e le c ea e cha ge. S , mild di e gageme i he cli ical em i f c i al b ec i e, a d i all aff kee h i g agai a d agai a d i h e i a i he e he ca ' ea il c ea e cha ge a d he ' e facili a ed d ha f m ab e. The e i me ha ca lead ha f e ha e e ligh dig e i a a ime. I ' f e a big e e ha c ea e ha , b i ' e, e, e e e , e, e, e i di id al ha add e ime ac all he l k, he e l k a a cli ical e i g a d a , "Wha ea h ha e ed he e? H did ha a ha e i g?" S , e eed c ide he e a e ma e le i he heal hca e i d a d he ' e de a e m am f e e, a d i ha e e ime a a ime. A d ha ' e e iall h e ee cli icia h ha e e ea a d ea a d ea d i g e e e le i eed, a d he ' e ac all a i e face ha ld a ee hem dem a i g beha i f m al di e gageme . S , ha le d e UX la i he c m le cli ical e i g ? A d h ca e de a d a d emed e hical fadi g i h jec i he heal hca e ace b al be d ha ? A UX e ea che , a egi a d de ig e , e ac all ha e a eall i e i ac a a -ga e he e e a i f e hical fadi g, a d ha ' l i he heal hca e ec , ha ' ac all ac he b a d. S , hile ha migh d like a eall , eall ma i e a eme , he e' a l f hi g ha ' e babl d i g al ead ha a e ac all ha i g ha f c i , b i ' babl j he " h " ha ' bee h gh a e hical fadi g le . Le ' l k f he i ha . S , ha ' he blem? The fi e i eall e l i g he
  7. N e ha hi i a edi ed a c

    i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i . Page 39 blem ace. S , hi i eall , eall im a , b i l . A e i l me i ed, he blem ace i heal hca e i f e a med be be ee he a ie a d he cli icia - ha ' he ace e hea f m f he blem c mi g f m. B he i e i h heal hca e e ice i deli e i m f e ha cli icia a e ac all bei g ided ha he eed make hi i e ac i be ee hem a d he a ie cc i a a ha i ac all alig ed i h be ac ice a d ideal a ie ca e deli e . S , k i g ha , if e c e he ace e l a d e a me he blem i be ee cli icia a d a ie , i ' ea j m i i h l i a d a , "OK, ma be e'll de ig a f a e ha ca ack he he e i defici i e ce , a d, ila, e e hi g ill ge ha he a a d he blem ill be l ed." B he e ki d f blem - he e ki d f l i i f a e i eall al ead i lace a d i ' ac all a i e f cl i g ha ga ff ha make h e e f l i i effec i e. S , beca e he e i feedback f m ha e f e i g, cli icia he a feel m all di e gaged beca e he ' e e i g hi a d e i g he c me a d ge i g feedback a d im eme . S , i ' eall im a ack ledge ha al h gh i migh eem like a b i l i , e eall eed l k a he blem m e b adl . S , if e c me back a d c e m e idel , if e add a le ha ' ki d f l ki g h gh a i k a e me f e hical fadi g, e ca ee ha he blem ace i ima il be ee cli icia a d ga i a i . A d ha mea ha hile he clie ma belie e ha he e d e i he a ie - a d, f c e, he a ie i a e im a c m e f he ic e a d c h - he ac al cli icia i he ac al e ha e eed be l ki g a . The ' e he e h a e deli e i g hi e ice. S , he e' e l ki g a c i g e ea ch c h , e eall eed make e ha e b i g cli icia he f ef f all c m e f he jec . A d d i g hi , f e e le
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    i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i . Page 40 a , "B ha ab he a ie ?" B d i g hi , ' e ig i g he a ie , ' e ac all l ki g a a ke f c i al deli e i ha a ie ' ca e, a d b ig i g i e' e ac all eall ig i g he ke i f ha deli e h e e ice . S , b i g cli icia f f - f , b e all i he ac al c e, he c h , e e d ide if i g eed f ha cli ical c h , b e' e able l k a he e he i ha e i c ea ed he e hical fadi g a d he imi be ee e ma ageme a d e ce ac all e l i ha fi di g. A d i add e i g h e ai i , a ie c me ill im e b defa l i h e e add e i g hem di ec l . S , b eaki g hi d a de ig e , a he a f he jec , heal hca e jec he i e, e eall eed im leme ha h gh de ig e ea ch ac ice i , like, a f ll c i g all la e i he blem ace. A d ha ' e eciall im a if ' e e ki g i he heal hca e ace, beca e i ' e , e c m le . S me im a a ce ki d f hi k f i ega d heal hca e a e beha i ha a e a cia ed i h e hical fadi g m al di e gageme . A d me f hem j be a a e f a e e hemi m , al maki g c m a i a d al hif i g blame. S , i e ea ch, if ' e icki g beha i like hi , he e a e ke i a hi ki g, "Y k ha ? I'm g i g dig dee i hi ." Beca e cli icia ha e hi , i ' ha kee hem afe i he i d , a d e eed ee he he ' e c mi g i he e ea ch a d he dig d l e , a d ha i g a e i i i ha ha ' a ch l gical b ffe ha i a ec i e mecha i m. S , i h ega d c e, if he e c ibed c e b he clie i ha f cli icia a d a ie , e eall eed e l e ha "cli icia " mea . I ' a i c edibl b ad i le, a d i hi each c m e f ha i le he e i i c edible hie a ch . I'm , I a j e I a he igh lide he e f a m me ! S , e eed hi k ab h e' e e gagi g a d he . S ,
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    i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i . Page 41 emembe i g ha e i aff a e f e e gaged i deci i -maki g b he ' e f e he e ac all a ha e face i he m e c a a . S , l ki g a he imi f ha hie a ch d a d , a d al c ide -cli ical aff a d h he feed i he cli icia e ice j e a ell. Tha ca all , k , eall hi k b adl . Thi k ab l chai , ec d ma ageme , affi g, a d he l k a he de l i g heme be ee h e, hich i f e ma ageme f b dge . S , he eed be c ide ed. S , m ch f he cli icia ' le i eall d i e b deci i ha ha e ab e hem, c i g eall eed b i g h e deci i -make i he ac al c i g jec . Wi h he i i mi d ha e' e i g ed ce imi f m e ma ageme he ai i , e eed ha imi ed ced beca e he imi i he e e hical fadi g c ee i . S , i a i g ha , e eed ma he e he blem ace ac all i , he e ma ageme i be ee cli ical i e face a d a ie a d cli icia c h , a d ha ill eall hel defi e h e ga eall clea l . S , i ' al im a emembe ha c i g e e ci e like hi , a I a a i g ea lie , ma ac all b i g a ici a i he c e ha ha e bee c ide ed i hi he c e. A d a de ig e , i ' eall highligh he im a ce f i cl di g e i he al a ici a ha ma be c ide ed f c e, a d eall h f a f fi di g e e ded ime b dge i cl de hem. Beca e i ' f e a im le a , k , ke la e . Al igh . Fi e mi e . OK. S , e eed l k a ed ci g imi , a I aid bef e. A d a UX de ig e , e' e i a eall i e i i b idge ha ga . A d e all k he e f a a i e, elli g, a d h im a ha i , b e ma ee a e hical eigh ha c me i h ha , hich i i c edibl im a . Whe i c me add e i g i e f e hical fadi g a d imi i he heal hca e ace, e eed b i g deci i -make
  10. N e ha hi i a edi ed a c

    i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i . Page 42 he ac al i e face. A d if ha ca be d e h icall , fa a ic. The e i hi g be e ha me e eei g ha cli icia a e deali g i h, ha i ac all ha e i g he ha e a a ie a d ca ' e e hem. B ha ' al a ible. S , he e ibili f , he , i ed ce ha imi b b i gi g he hem. A d a a i e i a i c edibl im a l i ha . S , a ec f a a i e ha a e eall im a a e: P i f ie , e ec i e, a d la g age. A d i hi he e c m e , e hical fadi g ca eall fi d a a . S , c ide h e l a i f he clie ' i f ie dic a e h he ie hem. S , f e am le, h ha ill ac all - he a a i e he ha e. A d f e a clie ill be eaki g f m he hi d e , he e he a ie i eak f m a fi e , a d e eed b i g hem cl e ge he . S , beca e, k , h e ie e le i a i a i i h e ie el e i ha i a i . S , b i gi g a a e e ha i f ie f all la e i e im a . A d ha lead e ec i e, hich dic a e h e label hi g . S , a eall cla ic e am le f hi i heal hca e a he m me i he label f ha e call me e h "c me " heal hca e. S , k , ' e i he bed, ' e ell, a d ' e c ide ed a a ie m f he ime. Thi i a label ha ' bee ed i ce he 14 h ce , i ' efe ed b b h cli icia a d a ie hem el e . B a i ee heal hca e em eed h e ame i a ie a a c me . A a cli icia i he a , he e' a I ld alk a bed ide a d a hi e i a c me , ch i g b a e ice. The e' a ha ' ha he ela i hi i . Y ca ee b imi , he age c ca hi k hi e i c mi g e ice . S , ha ' a eall g ea e am le f ha . I'm , I'm hi i g h gh beca e I eali e I'm i e h ime. >> I ' al igh . Y ' e g a li le bi f ime.
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    i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i . Page 43 NICOLE JESS: Tha k . Ma i g i a eall g ea a dem a e imi . A d hile e la gel ee ma i g e j e i ha defi e ha e f he de ig ce , i ' ac all a eall g ea l e i he di c e ha e, l elf a d he c e a d he clie a ell. S , ha migh ac all be i ega d clie , ma be able cl ck hei a m i f he clie a d hei imi . B he e i al a ec ha all he cl ck elf. S , ha ha ill all d i ee he e ma al e hicall fade i de be d clie eed , hich i i c edibl im a ide if . We all a clie be a i fied, b i ' eall im a e e e hicall . S , e all , I fi d ha if I'm e e ed i h a c e a d I' e ied h he b da i cl de e le ha a e ma be he e i he ie a d ha ' bei g de ied, I al a make e I ide if ha i he ack. A d ha migh be h gh e all ha I d i I a c e, jec limi a i ec i a he begi i g f he ackage, a d I i d ce " he e a e he limi a i a d hi i he im ac h e limi a i ha e," a d he gge h f he k ma be d e add e h e. Y ' e e i g he e hic a e de d i he jec a d he ' e j falli g i he had . Fi all , if e l k a c llab a i , h ' b a d. Ve , e c mm i he heal h ace, ec i i g f e le a , "F -li e aff a e j a ha d c ac . Le ' j de ig a d hem." Tha d e k. The e a e ma ime he i e face ill be e e ed i h a e iece f f a e a e iece f e i me ha l k like a d he e' all he e g ea idea i i , b ac all he cli icia ha e bee c l ed, i e d ei he be ed e l , c f ed. S , elc mi g all le el f cli icia i he de ig ce a he i f he e begi i g a d h gh he c llab a i e ce . A d k i g
  12. N e ha hi i a edi ed a c

    i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i . Page 44 h e gage a d he d e e i e me de a di g f he heal hca e ec a d c e. B , agai , a k e le, a k he c h , "Wh h ld I be eaki g ab hi ?" Beca e hi ill c me h gh f f m h e. A d, agai , cl i g ha l ff i h all e gageme . If ' e e gagi g i h he cli ical field, ack ledge ha ha c me f m ha a d feed i back. If he e i hi g g a be de el i g f a d f m he e ea ch ' e d e he de ig ' e d e, feed ha back a ell. I ' eall im a i cl de cli icia i ha l de a d ha I ha e aid ha bee hea d, b he e i a l i a hi i i ime, a he ha j eaki g i a id. S , hile I' e la gel f c ed e hical fadi g i he cli ical ace da , e hical fadi g a d m al di e gageme , f a el , i e e he e. E e he e ha h ma i e ac a d make deci i , e eciall he he e' a hie a ch i l ed. S , i cl i g ff, if I'm ake a a i hi e i i h a fe akea a . E hical fadi g cc f m he d . I c me f m he a d e l i m al di e gageme he i di id al le el. I ' le a de ig e eall e h gh e ea ch de ig ac ice c e a d ma i de de a d he c m le i ie , he i e al hie a chie , a d imi ie i hi h e ec . We eed be mi df l f he la g age ha i dica e a d facili a e e hical fadi g. A d a de ig e , e eall eed e e ha he d ha e ha e, ha a e ha ed i h f m a ici a , a e ca ied h gh i a he ic f m. S , he eall ca he e e ec i e ha he e e deli e ed i . I ' ab maki g i c e ie , i ' ab ca i g ha ice f a d. F he , e al eed e e ha d i ega d e c ea i a d a f i e c e a e eall ca ef ll c ide ed i h e ec hei ca aci ed ce c ea e ha imi ha ca he elc me e hical fadi g i he e. A d eall be a a e ha d b ea he ace i
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    i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i . Page 45 ha id he e e hical ac ice ca eak i . A d fi all , e eall eed be c age a d illi g ake ha e hical a ce a d h f i cl i i a d e gageme i h akeh lde ha e e e ha c llab a i a d c -de ig cc ac he jec i h he igh e le. S , i h all ha i mi d, I eall h lehea edl e c age di e i jec i he heal h ace. I ca feel e helmi g a d c m le , a d e ha e e c f i g, b I ca ell i ' i c edibl e a di g. A d he a ee hi g ha ' e de ig ed la i g i he ec a d maki g a diffe e ce, i ' j dee l e a di g. If a f fi d elf i jec a d ' e ki d f immi g i he , I am al a e a Li kedI c ac a d I'm m e ha ha hel a iga e a h gh he jec . S , ha k m ch f ime. (APPLAUSE) MAGS HANLEY: Tha k m ch, Nic le, f d i g hi . A d I l ed - I a he e i i g e . I k I ha e e i , b I a he e i i g e a d I ide ified a c le f hi g ha I l ked a , a d i ' m e ha j i he heal h ec . A d he fi e a ac all i m ga i a i , i ga i a i ha I' e bee , he e I' e l ked a he c ical e i g i a ic la l e gi ee i g eam . Whe e he ld i he e a d g , "Y a e di c ec ed f ." Y c ld hea ha c ical e c mi g h gh, "Wh a e e d i g hi ?" I hi k ha e hical fadi g k e ell, e eciall i me f he la ge ga i a i I' e bee i , i he la 10 ea , he e c ld j g , "Highe i hea i g ha c ec i bei g b ke , he ' e hea i g." Tha ' i . NICOLE JESS: E ac l .
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    i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i . Page 46 MAGS HANLEY: A d he ec d e f me a ac all he c e a i ab e ice , he e m f a e g i g ha e ga i a i ' ma ageme c ec ed a all a b a ch bei g i a ffice, bei g li e. S , I ked i e-c mme ce i Melb e, a d e f he fi hi g he a ked d a g i a d e d da i he ac al e hem el e . Beca e i a he a f a c ec i . N , I ked f e ail, I did 6.5 ea ki g f M e . S , he I e i e ail a d I e a c le f da i he back m f JB Hi-Fi, i a mal ff ha I had d e ma , ma ime . B I ca ee h e e- e i g i i he ga i a i . S , ha a he he bi , hich i h d e make e ha he he a e c ec i g ha ' he g d i a e ice de ig jec ? S , h e e e m idea a d he c ec i ha e e c mi g h gh he e. NICOLE JESS: A d ha ' he i e i i e h ld, i ac all be ha c ec . Beca e ma ac all ha e, k , a c mi g JB, migh a , "The e a e e le he e, b ge e le c ec ed, ge hem alki g," beca e ha ' he e mee . "OK, like ha ? Fa a ic." The ' e g e le c ec i g a d he he di c i ca ha e a d ha , a d h ma e . Ra he ha bei g, "Y ' e e ma ageme a d I'm a aid 20-mi e b eak a d I'm i e e ed i alki g." I ' ab facili a i g ha c ec i a ell. MAGS HANLEY: Q e i f m he g ? >> Hi. I ee a l f hi . I a ki g i ech il i e ece l , a d e had a de ice li e ge ha ki d f ea e f acce i he l chai . A d f m eei g ha a d l ki g a hi
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    i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i . Page 47 e e a i - b illia . H did fi d ha i i a i ki d f c ec he cli ical a d he e hical fadi g UX a d b i g ha ki d f ac ice i ? Wa i f m a cli ical e ec i e a d had ha aha m me ? O did g f m he de ig e ec i e a d g , "OK, I ca ee h ha ki d f fi i "? NICOLE JESS: Defi i el i he ace... I a a eciali i a e i life. A d i eall fel ... (I di i c ) a d hi a a i e de ig i g le. P i g i ge he a a c f i g, beca e he i f ac all eedi g (i di i c ). I'm ca ed i ill k, a d he I'm i a eall bad i a i . A d hi a ab a $170,000 de ice ha a ided he a d ha a ed i age he h le ime, b i a l a ed . S , i a he m me f, "Wh a e hi g bei g c l ed?" Y ee i all he ime i a chi ec al de ig i diffe e e i g . Y k , migh ha e a bi hi g i he e a d he i e i e ca e, a he a d, a d i ' like, "H i ha de ig ed be e ?" Ple f idea f l i , b e le a e ' e gaged de a d he i k f he e ca be life a d dea h. I ' like, "Y ma l e e le. I ' eall c i ical." S , i e m ch came f m a cli ical ace f i g d i e cha ge i hi ha . Bei g i ha ace, i ' e ha d c ea e cha ge. S , I a like, "Thi i a h ge i k, b I'm g i g d i beca e I ca ee ha he e a e a ea ha eall eed cha ge." >> Hi, Nic le. Reall e j ed ha . I a hi ki g f m he e ec i e f c me . A el j a c me f heal hca e e ice , I a i a i a ce he e, f me, k , m medical ec d - he bl d e e a OK, he ke me ic e e l ki g OK f m m d c ' e ec i e - b f me, i a ab ai a d he fac ha m ai i ill ma aged. S , a a a ie , m c me e e diffe e
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    i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i . Page 48 ha he cli icia ' c me e e. I a de i g - I'm kee hea ie he he c me la a le i f he e hical ea me , a d h ha ki d f ela e he h le e hical fadi g? NICOLE JESS: Yeah, ab l el . A d i ' i e e i g ha icked ai , beca e i ' ch a diffic l e ea . S , f e ha 'll fi d i ha , f e am le, eah, a a ie ma be ell ch l gicall ma be ill e e ie ci g ai , b he cli icia ca ' j if he kee i g me he e he e he , b e a i - i e, he ' e able. Tha ' f m a bed ma ageme i f ie a d a ac al f di g i f ie . S , e ca ' f d f a a ie ha ' cli ical able. S , he e a e a ie e ice ha ma deal i h ai a d hi g like ha . B ha a i i f m he i f ie f bei g i he h i al i he bed acce i g h e e ice ide he h i al i f ll f i fall . A d ha ' he e ca ge me eall , eall i e e i g heal h jec . Like, OK, h ca e he l k a a a ie ha ' i ai a d e e iall eed be di cha ged f m h i al, h ca e de ig a e ice ha a i i hem a ie life i a a he e he d ' feel he ' e im a ? S , he ' e he eall i e e i g a ea i heal h jec . H ca e make ha li e f ca e ac all feel like ca e? MAGS HANLEY: I'm j ha i g ligh fla hback . S , f h e f h d ' k , I a a le kaemia a ie f a mbe f ea , a d ha a ie c ec i be ee bei g i a ie , a ie - I a a i a ie h ee ime f f i eek , a d he m i g i a ie , i ' ha m me he e I'm j g i g, "Oh, eah, he e a e defi i el i he e he e e c ld ha e made i be e . O me he did a ic la l ell."
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    i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i . Page 49 NICOLE JESS: S me e ice ha e bee de ig ed bea if ll , a d ha ' f e beca e he ' e e gaged all akeh lde . The ' e alki g a ie , he ' e alki g he aff ha a e di cha gi g, he ' e alki g he ecei i g aff a d i g fi d h e c ec i a d h he m h ha e . B he i e e i g e ha a e, "OK, he he ' e he e, he 'll acce hi e ice." I ' like, "Yeah, ha e a e i ch ic ai , he ' e i c edibl i ed, he ma ha e e m ch cial , he ma ha e a l f f di g, he ma be able de a d h acce e ice . A d h d e ide i ha ega d?" Y k , i ' j like, "Yeah, he e' a e ice, he ca acce i ." H ca e facili a e ha acce i a a ha eall ha i di id al, h ill eed ca e, al h gh hei b a e e ha able? MAGS HANLEY: O e m e e i . >> Falli g h gh he ga ? NICOLE JESS: Al a . >> U le k me e ha h e, ha a , "Make e a k he igh e i , make e c ec i h hi ." NICOLE JESS: A d ha ' e ac ... >> (I di i c ) NICOLE JESS: A d ha ' h I a e a d he c e a d eak he e le. If ha e cli ical aff, a k, "Wh ld eak if
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    i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i . Page 50 eeded he e blem l ed?" A d he ill ai i f . I ' ea hi k, "Well, I'll j a me h ' he e a d he e." B a k he e le h a e he e. Reall , cli icia a cha ge, he a i i e cha ge. B if i ' like, "He e g , I de ig ed hi ." I ' like, "He e i ha a k f a d he e i h eac i i made be e , im e me hi g ab a em e ma k a l ab ." >> (I di i c ) NICOLE JESS: Yeah. Ab l el . Ab l el . B I eall , eall e c age ge i l ed i heal hca e jec . The e i m ch eed. A d, eah, e , e e a di g. If e e eed hel , c ac me! MAGS HANLEY: Tha k m ch. NICOLE JESS: Tha k . (APPLAUSE) MAGS HANLEY: We eed fi e mi e . We' e g fi e mi e . (BREAK) MAGS HANLEY: I'll j gi e hem a he mi e . A d if d ' mi d, he migh da h i . We'll a . Michelle i a eache a d (i di i c ). S , he' alki g ab bel gi g i de ig . MICHELLE OU: Tha k , Mag . S , hi, e e e. Tha k , Mag , al f