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Bec Purser - Are you consulting, collaborating, or co-designing? And why it matters.

uxaustralia
March 18, 2022

Bec Purser - Are you consulting, collaborating, or co-designing? And why it matters.

Co-creation, co-design, collaboration, or participatory design are terms you see a lot at the moment. This talk aims to unpack these terms by revisiting their origins and discussing the ethical and political implications of conflating them. The session will also provide clear and easily implementable strategies on when to use which method.

uxaustralia

March 18, 2022
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  1. N e ha hi i a edi ed a c i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i
    i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be
    c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i .
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    UX A a a
    D R a c 2022
    F da , 18 Ma c 2022
    Ca i ed b : Ca el D e & Ti a Fall

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  2. N e ha hi i a edi ed a c i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i
    i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be
    c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i .
    Page 81
    STEVE BATY: Tha all l k g d.
    BEC PURSER: Al igh . A e c l i g, c llab a i g, c -de ig i g?
    A d h i a e . The a e e ha ee a l a he e ,
    i cl di g a hi c fe e ce. Thi alk ai ack he e e b
    e i i i g hei igi a d di c i g he e hical a d li ical i lica i
    f c fla i g he . M a e i Bec P e , I' a e i a age f
    e ice de ig a T a f NSW. I a age a ea f e ice
    de ig e h k ac c le , l i dal i f a c e a d
    e ice la i g jec ac he S a e. I' a i a e ab
    a ici a de ig c -de ig , blic a a d ec la i e de ig .
    A a g ad a e f he de ig a h l g Ma e g a he e I
    eciali ed i hi a I dige c e , ca ee h hi i a ic
    cl e hea . A e ga he i hi c fe e ce i hi h icall
    di e e a d c c ed ace le eflec lace a d ec g i e he
    a i adi i al la d i hich e k, li e, lea a d e i da . We
    ack ledge he Elde a , e e a d e e gi g f he la d ha e
    k a d li e . I e all a ack ledge he Wa gal e le f
    he E a a i a I eak f hei la d da . Thi alk a ed
    i h a a I a ha i g i h a f ie d a d fell e e e . I ee ed
    fi i g i cl de i . Thi ill f he ha a d he h f
    e e a i . A e h ha ked i h e f e ha 5 i e
    ca a e l e f igi ie a d al a a i g k he e
    hi g ca e f . I ill gi e ef l i i e f he h a d he
    he . The ha a d he h . B c fla i g he e e e di i i h he
    al e f all f he e c ce . Pa ici a de ig , c -de ig ,
    c -c ea i , c - e a i e de ig , e de ig - he e a e all e ha
    ha e d f he a e i ila hi g f he la 50 ea .

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  3. N e ha hi i a edi ed a c i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i
    i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be
    c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i .
    Page 82
    C - e a i e de ig i a g abl he igi e al h gh he e a e a
    bla ed igi f Pla R ia Ge a , he idel
    ack ledged he Sca di a ia i he 1970 a d 1980 . Whe A e ica
    g i e e ed i hi a ach he e e e c ce . I a called
    a ici a de ig , a d hi a i i ed c -de ig i he la e '90
    a d ea l 2000 he he e h d a ed bei g called a ici a a d
    he ce bega be called c -de ig . S e ill a g e ha c -de ig
    a d c -c ea i g f he . C -de ig i a ici a de ig l he
    i cl i f akeh lde a d c -c ea i i hi , l he i cl i f e d
    e i he d c i a d deli e ha e f a d c e ice. U ba
    de ig a ed i he ea l 2000 a d a a f he e ce
    e e . I ha he a e igi a a ici a de ig a d b 2010 i
    beca e a a ife all f i . I e che he c ce i he idea f
    ha i g j he ce f de ig , b al he c e . The e
    e , a I' e ec g i e, a e c l ed a d a e f e ed
    i e cha geabl , e e h gh he e a e a g e f hei diffe e ce .
    F he e f da e ill l e he e c -de ig a d el
    he e defi i i . The fi bei g, a de ig ce ha i l e e d
    e i he de ig c e a ac i e c -de ig e . Thi c e f a
    g ea efe e ce b k called U i e al Refe e ce f de ig b Ma i a d
    Ha i g . The ec d c e f a de f l de ig e called
    McKle che . The e a e all h a e ha I ha e hea d ead i he la fe
    ea . We c -de ig ed he l i i h i e al akeh lde . O
    i e al c -de ig k h had g ea e l . We e e ed he
    c ce a ici a i c -de ig e i . A d he a e
    c -de ig , a i gle e f he . The e a e g ea e a le f
    c llab a i a d c l a i , b he ' e c -de ig . B calli g he e
    c -de ig e dd he a e i h akeh lde a d c lleag e . We
    ake i ha d i le e eal c -de ig i i ia i e i he f e a d e

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  4. N e ha hi i a edi ed a c i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i
    i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be
    c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i .
    Page 83
    di i i h he k f h e h d . I ead, e eed a ha e
    c llab a ed de ig he l i i h i e al akeh lde . O
    i e al c llab a i k h ha e g ea e l . We e e ed
    c ce a ici a i c l a i e i . The he hi g e d
    b c fla i g he e e i di i i h he al e f c l a i a d
    c llab a i . N e f h e e e e bad de ig ce , b he a e '
    c -de ig . C llab a i i a adical ac a d i h ld be celeb a ed.
    C l a i i a i a a f de ig a d de c ac . I d ' a
    lea e da hi ki g a f he e a e be e ha a he . The
    a e all i a . The all deli e al e he d e a he icall a d he
    a e all f e d e l . C -de ig i al d i g ha e e he
    a ici a ell . Like he e a le hich e e ille ial i hi
    ill de a d, he H e Si ca , aki g e ac l ha he e d
    e a ici a a - hi i ' de ig e ea ch. De ig e ea ch i
    c -de ig ei he . Whe e a k a a ici a a e d e
    de c ibe hei l i a e X hei e be Y, he e a e e ea ch
    e i a d h ld be a al ed acc di gl . Y ca a d h ld
    i cl de a ici a e h d i de ig e ea ch b le
    a ici a he el e j i i he de ig ce , hi i
    c -de ig . A hi i igh be de i g, h d I ca e ch
    ab ha i a d i ' c -de ig ? Y a al be hi ki g, i ' i j a
    c ac i f d , c a i ge he a d de ig , he ef e e
    de ig ge he , i ha he a e hi g? Fi e a d a i he a e
    hi g. A e di i c c ce ca be f ed he i g d
    ge he . I ld a ecia e i if b gh e a a d a a d
    e e fi e if h e a fi e. Tha i h i i i a . W d
    ha e ea i g a d e le h ld ge ha he a k f . C l a i ,
    c llab a i a d c -de ig a e all al able. C l a i i ab kee i g
    e le i f ed a d fi di g e i e . C llab a i i ab ha i g he

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  5. N e ha hi i a edi ed a c i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i
    i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be
    c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i .
    Page 84
    ce i h fe i al . C -de ig i ab ha i g he ce i h
    h e h a e i ac ed he . We' e g i g j e hi
    a d I' g i g ake h gh h ee aj de el e
    c de ig a d h he cha ged he ac ice bef e e a alki g ab
    h he igh i ac . We all e a g ea deal f g a i de
    K i e N gaa d he fa he f ke i l e e i k lace f
    c e de el e a d e. Hi jec i h he N egia e al
    ke i i 1971 ade i i ial e f adi i al e ea ch a d
    de el e c e e ki g i h e le di ec l
    cha gi g a d aki g a e ac i e le f he l cal i i he
    cha gi g k l f i e be . The jec e ha i ed he i
    ha ke ha e he igh a d d a ici a e i deci i
    c ce i g he . Wha e a e de el ed a d h h e e
    a e de ig ed, a d i ee i e fi i g f he fi ig ifica
    a ici a a ache ha e hei igi i N a a d he
    Sca di a ia egi i ce i he 1960 , i hi egi e e le ha
    e e ag eed i d a d ec a a h le h ld he
    de c a ic i ci le i cie - he he a d. Thi jec
    had a g ea i fl e ce he f ll i g e ea ch a d de el e f e
    a ici a i , i e de el e leadi g c - e a i e
    a ici a de ig . The ai ac i i ie i P jec U ia i cl ded al
    lea i g be ee all ac i e a ici a , he g a hic ke , he
    c e cie i a d he cial cie i . C d f
    g a hic i d e hibi a d i a lab a ie i he US.
    Re i e e ecifica i f e e e bei g de el ed f e
    i ead f he b i e / a age e . The d f a li e il he he
    i age e a i eal d c i a d he di e i a i , e eciall
    g a hic ke a d he cie ific c i a e e l f he ce
    e e idel ha ed. D i e b ide l g , P jec U ia led he a f

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  6. N e ha hi i a edi ed a c i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i
    i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be
    c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i .
    Page 85
    c -de ig i hi a k c e . I ' i a e ha c l a i
    a d he ha i g f i f a i a ill c cial d i g a d af e hi
    jec . C llab a i i h h e US e ea ch a i cl di g Xe PARC,
    S a f d U i e i a d he a he f ef f h a -ce ed de ig ,
    lea i g a d ha i g i h he de ig fe i al a d c e
    cie i a a e e ial a f hi jec . The c -de ig a
    achie ed h gh a d al eed. The i d a cha gi g
    d a a icall . Pa ici a i he ce e e illi g a l beca e he
    had he i be. C -de ig a ee a a ea e e ha
    e ech l g ed a d e ha ced ke ' k ledge a d kill
    a he ha edefi ed eli i a ed hei j b . H e e , I hi k i '
    i a ack ledge ha hi jec a e a bi i a i
    c ld ha e bee . U ia gh ec he c af a hi f
    cc a i al g a d e- ai h e h c ld be ec ed. I did
    c ide he e a a h le a d i a ' i i a , i a e
    eac i a . The e e c ea i g a i i f ha he f e a be,
    he e e l e di g he cha ge ha had a d e e c i i g
    ha e he . The e e a le h ab h c -de ig ed
    f he li ical he c e cial. Da f i he la ge a fac i g
    c a i De a k d ci g i d ial d c ch a fl e e ,
    e e a e e a d c lle ed i a di e e a ge f l ca i
    f e a ke a e a e ea e la a d e e i a e
    h e . Da f ed he facili a f behi d e- a gla . The
    he de ig e e i he field a d he he e i he de ig
    di . O e he ea , hei d c ha e g e e a d e
    c le , b he ha e c i ed hei f c a d hei ela i hi i h
    e d e . The ake d c ha a e i alled a d ed b e e i
    hei field. The fi al be efi igh be fel b e le like a d e ch
    a clea a e , ef ige a ed d c i a e a ke a d a ea ha

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  7. N e ha hi i a edi ed a c i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i
    i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be
    c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i .
    Page 86
    e, b he e d e a e he i alle , he l be a d he c e . A
    g ea e a le jec f Da f a a i i jec . The ai a
    i e iga e i ie f e d c c l a e a e
    ea e ce e . A f c a a e a e la i De a k a d
    S ede a d he de el e ce e gaged ce e a ,
    ech icia a d elec icia i he c ce ali i g f e ial i a i
    f i hi a 8-10 ea h i . Da f e a la ge be f
    c e i a e a e a d a e la like fl e e e a d
    d i e . The c -de ig a li i h ee ec i i hi jec . O e, i
    field b e a i i h he a ici a , he de ig e a d he e ea che
    j i he f a f ll hif fil i g hei ac i i ie a he da e . T ,
    c llec i e a al i e i i h a ici a de a d a d de el
    i igh f he f age, e a d he h . The , he e e e
    k h he e 30- l e le ca e ge he i cl di g he
    a ici a , de ig e , de el e , eabili e e a d fe i al
    ge e a e l i . A ide effec f hi jec a ha Da f
    ide ified h il ed hei ga i a i a a d h hi a ifli g
    i a i . Maj b acle i ga i i g he e k h e e ha
    ea e e ga i ed b f c i - fl e ea i g, al e c l ,
    he ea he i a i la i i eg a i g d c ac b i e i .
    The had la ed ede ig d c , b he e ded ede ig i g
    he el e . H fa he al did ede ig a d c la chi g he
    Walke ali e e, hich c bi e e e al e d ce e
    eadi g ha e a ld che i h - ll i c . D i e b efficie c
    a d a d i e f c e cial ad a age, Da f c i ed he k f c
    f c -de ig . The ea decided challe ge h ee h f e ea ch a d
    de el e i hei ac ice. O e, ha e ea che be i a ial.
    T , ha de ig e ca be like e e e bjec he ill
    i fl e ce he e l . Th ee, e d e d ha e he kill he

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  8. N e ha hi i a edi ed a c i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i
    i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be
    c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i .
    Page 87
    i a iali be a f he de ig ce . The la e a le I a
    b i g a e i i a g hich i he jec f blic ace .
    U ba de ig a d a chi ec e ha e bee e f he ke lace he e
    he e e h d a d hil hie ha e bee e b aced b ac i i e
    h c ea e f e d e h a e ece a il i i ed a he
    e e . The a e e f he ea ie a d be e a le f hi a ach
    bei g i le e ed i A alia. Si ce I k f a , la ge
    i f a c e jec he a e al a a i f i e. Si ce 1975
    jec f blic ace ha hel ed e 3,500 c i ie ac 50
    c ie e-i agi e hei f e a d ee he e eed h gh blic
    ace. I a ed b b ildi g he e ea ch f Willia Whi e a d ha e
    e l ed i a agi g blic ace i h e le h e he e e
    da . The igi al jec a i led P blic S ace be Pla ed a If
    Pe le Ma e hich i g i a d i i i g all a he a e i e. Willia
    Whi e i a lege da ba i a d e le a ch e h e k d i e
    a ba de ig e a d lace ake da . He did hi a a i e he
    ch a h l gical b e a i had bee a lied die f
    I dige c l e i fa - ff a d e ic l ca i , b al e e he
    gl bal e . While ki g f he Ne Y k Ci Pla i g C i i i
    1969 Whi e bega de , h he e l - la ed ci ace e e
    ac all ki g , e hi g - e had c ide ed a k i e ea ch
    bef e. Thi c i i led he ee ligh jec , a i ee i g d i
    ede ia beha i a d ci d a ic . P jec f blic ace had
    ake hi i igh , b al hi al e a d ha e e ded he i a e f
    de ig l a d a ache ha ca be ed de ig ace i h he
    e le h e he . Pe el e C b i a ba f i h b gh
    hi ac ice A alia a d Ne Zeala d i he 1990 i h jec
    ac Melb e, S d e , he S hi e C a , Pe h a d A ckla d,
    i cl di g he Pe h C l al Ce e ic ed he e. P jec f blic ace

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  9. N e ha hi i a edi ed a c i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i
    i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be
    c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i .
    Page 88
    led he a f c -de ig i hi he e e da . The e e ' ece a il
    he fi d hi , b he a e e f he be e a le f h de ig
    a ake a a f he k lace a d a a f e e . Whe I a
    "e e " I a call he e e le a e ill e e i hei li e
    a d eed , he j d ' ha e he alifica i he ce ifica i i
    he a e a ha he e i jec ' a ici a did. The jec
    e e de ig ed i h he c i , g i g ch f he ha i l
    c l i g he al g he a . H e e , i ' i a e i ha
    c l a i a ill a ke a f he ce , a e e c i
    e be a ca be i cl ded i he de ig ce . C llab a i i
    ill eeded, j i h he e e , b he e i f e l i le
    la d e i l ed f diffe e le el f g e e diffe e
    c cil i a e la d e ili ie j de he g d.
    C -de ig a b il e i e. Wi h he e jec e be ca ef l
    i cl de l eak heel . I ' i a ha e d ' l e gage
    h e h ha e he i e, e e g a d he e ce h a
    c i f . S ha ca e lea f h e h ca e bef e
    i h he he a d he h ? We' e g i g a b f c i g he
    he . A a f g ea l ch i ia - if e e e ge back
    he e - he e a e he h ee akea a i I a ake a a f
    hi e i . C -de ig i a ic la l i able he de ig i g f i h
    c le e . T , eed be h ble, i a ial a d h ee,
    l g- e ela i hi ca be c l i a ed a d al ed. De ig i g f
    i h c le e . The d c c ea ed a d a fac ed b
    Da f a e f e l a all a f he ech ical e c ea i g
    e ceedi gl c le a d i e de e de e i e i hich all
    cha ge ca ha e la ge a ifica i . The di ec i cl i f e d e
    hel he de ig ea h gh hei abili de a d a d a ici a e
    c le i ie , e ial i e a d be efi f h l i igh i ac

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  10. N e ha hi i a edi ed a c i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i
    i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be
    c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i .
    Page 89
    he c e a a h le. U like P jec U ia hich a d i g hi f he
    g d f he ke , Da f a d i g i f efficie c . I i ea ie a d
    chea e k di ec l i h he e d e ha f de ig e lea all
    he c le i ie f hei ade. The ef e I i h e e hi f a e k
    f ide if i g c -de ig i ie . I ha a i . Ac he ce e
    i he c le i f e a d he a d d i he c le i f
    d c . C -de ig i a i able he he d c e i i le, b
    he deli e he c ea i i c le . Thi k i a ce, blic a
    a d elec ica i . Diffe e a f e ga i a i ca al be
    e le i able. S a i g i h a ba ki g e a le be e
    de a d hi . H e le e a i g acc ca be e
    c lica ed. The ha e a egie f i g e i , a
    e c i g . S e e le ha e l i le acc i h a diffe e
    g al f each. S e e le ill e e a age b i e e e e
    a d he a age e al e e e . S e e le kee he ec e
    f hei a e a d e i e kee he ec e f
    he el e . O he ill e e a age h eh ld e e e d e
    c le c d ag ee e . The e i a l f c lica ed e g i g ,
    b he d c i i e i le. The ' e highl eg la ed a d a a f
    i e e a e a d e e ice e e ie ce he ' e all ab he a e.
    Whe ea h e l a a e ki d f he i e. The d c i e
    c le a d i e i e a l f e le e i . A a f he
    cca i al all id- i e de el e , hei e h ld ' a - i le.
    Pa e i , cca i all check he a d a e i i e e h ee
    f ea ee if he ca ge a be e i e e a e. P blic a
    e ice i h he c le i f afe a d e gi ee i g c di i e
    ce e a i he be lace f c -de ig el beca e he le el f
    c di i a d c ai ha ld eed g ide a ici a
    h gh i e e . H e e , if ace i adjace blic a

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  11. N e ha hi i a edi ed a c i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i
    i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be
    c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i .
    Page 90
    a e ela i el i le i hei c c i , b e c le i hei e.
    Pe le e he d b i e , legal a d illegal. The ciali e, he
    d , he fall i l e, he ela , he e e ci e, he ai , he la .
    S e e le e e li e he e. Thi ake he e ace a g ea
    i f c -de ig . I d a e ha he e i ill al e
    d i g a ici a de ig ac i i ie i all he ad a e e c -de ig
    b he e he c le i f he e ee i lici f he d c i a
    e i a ea. Be h ble b i a ial. N be 2. C -de ig
    i a e f l , i i a a ach ha i g he e f he de ig
    ce i h h e h a e i ac ed he . Thi i a ce hich i
    f e e e e e ga i a i . We all k a de ig e h
    ca e a d h ld e hei de ig . The d g ea k,
    de ig a a i g hi g b ca be i a ial he i i g e a
    a ici a , a e h ch he he ca hel b g ab he
    e, ll a face e e c ec a a ici a . H ble i diffe e , b
    he a e. Ma ke e ea ch a d a he f f cial e ea ch
    bei g i a ial a ede al, b c -de ig diffe . Y d ' eed be
    i a ial, eed be h ble, c i a d dedica ed hif i g he
    e i bala ce i he e ela i hi . C -de ig ca be he f
    ld . Y ill h ld he e ibili a he fe i al i he ,
    b gi e c l f e . Y ' e ill e ible f he c e
    a d i i ac . We alked i he begi i g ab h e f he a e
    cha ge ha e bee hake ff he li ic f hi c ce , b c -de ig
    ill al a be a li ical ac . 3, he al e f l g- e ela i hi . The
    b a di g ce i l g a d diffic l , a ic la l he he be
    c -de ig a ici a a e h e i h i e li ed e e ie ce. C -de ig
    k be he ca b ild he e gage e e i e a d l i le
    jec . Thi i j ab kill a d de a di g, i ' ab
    b ildi g . Thi i e eciall e f k lace de ig ce a i , he e

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  12. N e ha hi i a edi ed a c i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i
    i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be
    c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i .
    Page 91
    ' e a ki g e le each ha e i h hei a ke able
    kill e e hei a c i ed k-a d . Thi i e f he ke
    cce e i P jec U ia. The ke ed he i , he
    beca e illi g a ici a i he ce ha a g i g d a icall
    a d d a a icall de abili e hei k. Thi i a e c ce f
    de ig e ea che . We' e all fa ilia i h b ildi g a , b I hi k e
    ha e be i df l ha he eed f hi a d he eff e i ed be
    cce f l f c -de ig ca be ake a e e e. The ef e, if a e
    c ide i g c -de ig , I c el hi k, a I eall ead f he
    i e e f i e a d e i al lab ? A I able fi d al able a d
    illi g a ici a h a e al ead ? Tha a a l f " he " le '
    a i e "h ". The h ee hi g I a c e bef e e fi i h
    da i ec i i g, f c i g li ed e e ie ce de g a hic
    e e e a i , b a di g a d facili a i , bei g a g ea h a d
    a i g all a d he fig i g h kee i g i g. Li ed
    e e ie ce e de g a hic e e e a i . Thi al i ' e f
    de ig e ea ch. We a e f e hed de a e h a le
    a e e e e a i e e e he ha i i ible i h ali a i e e ea ch.
    Thi i a ha de ce , h gh, i h he le el f c i e f
    c -de ig e gage e a e i e. Ha e a i d e f e l i g
    c - ke a he ha ec i i g a ici a . Pe le h ld be
    c e a ed f hei i e, b al eed i ch i he a ell,
    beca e ' e a ki g f e ha hei i e. Y ' e a ki g f hei
    c ea i i . Tha ca ake e ha e . I he i ch a d la , ake
    e c ide f he ce ab ha he ill ge . F Da f i
    a be e e i e . F jec f blic ace i a a be e lace
    li e. Thi i a h gel i a e i he e gagi g i h
    di ad a aged g . I jec g i g deli e al e j
    e ac i ? O b a di g a d facili a i - be a g ea h . C -de ig a a

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  13. N e ha hi i a edi ed a c i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i
    i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be
    c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i .
    Page 92
    a ach i j a a i de. Y eed be a h . Y eed
    c ide hei eed . Pla h e e e, i cl di g fe i al
    akeh lde ca ge he be f hei i e agai . Wha ha e
    lea f e e la i g, e e ie ce de ig a d e e eddi g la i g
    ill hel he e. The i a hi g i ake he i d e f
    he h . Y a e e ible f e le' e gage e , hei afe - b h
    e i al a d h ical - hei f a d hei . S a all a d kee
    g i g. Fi d a de ig ble , a be a d c e ha c ld be
    i able f c -de ig . C ide a ici a h ha e al ead
    e gaged - ld a f he be i able f j i i g he de ig ce
    f hi ble ? De ig a e gage e ha lea e he d e f
    f he e gage e a d b ild ela i hi . Thi i diffic l d he
    ' e c l i g, b if a e i -h e clie ide hi i a g ea
    i . If ' e clie ide, c ide h a ici a ee
    a be i able f he clie ' jec . Ca b ild a ela i hi
    ag ic f he d c e he a ic la b a d? I l ha e 40
    i e da he e' a I ca ide a f ll g ide h
    la , deli e c -de ig e gage e . The e a e h ee e ce I a ed
    i i he di ec i f. The e' l f i e , h gh leade
    a d g ide h ld l k , b he e h ee I ec e d. Fi i
    Be d S ick N e , a ac ical g ide eal c -de ig d i g. Kell A e
    ha d e a g ea j b lli g ge he a ac i able g ide hich I i h
    e i ed he I a d i g Ma e g a . Li Sa de i e f
    he e i al e ea che i c -de ig a d ide g ea e ce a he
    eb i e ake l .c . If hi g el e, I a ake a a f
    da , d ' be a ha ed f c llab a i c l a i , f he
    ac i i ie he e . If ' e c ide i g c -de ig ake he i e
    hi k ab he he ha e he igh d c , he igh a die ce, he
    igh i d e . The e i hi g g i h i cl di g a ici a

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  14. N e ha hi i a edi ed a c i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i
    i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be
    c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i .
    Page 93
    e h d i k. S a all a d ake e a d c -de ig .
    Ma be ' ge he e, b a be e e eeded . Tha k
    f i e a d a e i da .
    STEVE BATY: Tha k e ch, Bec. A c le f e i ha e c e
    h gh, he fi e f Mikaela, he e d ee he f e f he
    ac ice f e i l g f c -de ig g i g? Sh ld e c i e i ee
    he igh age f hi e ?
    BEC PURSER: I ld like kee he e . I like he a ach i called
    c -de ig a d he a ach i called a ici a e h d . Whe he e
    ca ai ai ha i e i able, be h e .
    STEVE BATY: A e he e a ea f he e e ha e ' hed i
    ace e he e c -de ig a d a ici a e h d ca eall add
    al e b e d ' ee be d i g i e ?
    BEC PURSER: I ha e ' ee a e a le f i d e i hi edical
    a ie e i g , b I hi k he e a e e eall bea if l k ha
    c ld be d e i ha ace. The e i ch a i e f he e
    i bala ce, a hi g he e he e i a high e i bala ce be ee
    he e le deli e i g he e ice a d he e le e e ie ci g he e ice
    feel like a a ea ha e h ld be l ki g a j f a e hical
    a d i .
    STEVE BATY: S e e a ked, bei g i a ial he c d c i g e ea ch
    i d illed i a de ig e ea che , h ca e hif he h ble
    a ach?

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  15. N e ha hi i a edi ed a c i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i
    i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be
    c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i .
    Page 94
    BEC PURSER: I hi k hif i he gi e a e e ce ha
    d ' ca e. O e f he eake hi i g a alki g ab i a
    ab di abili a d ki g i h e le i h de e ia. S , ha a
    e e da a d e. The eall ca ed a d g i l ed i he e
    e le' li e . I ' h i hi g el e f ha a de ig e a d
    e ea che .
    STEVE BATY: I c e a a c a d All a d B idge e e alki g ab
    he e i al b de f ha k a d he e i al c f ha k.
    I ' i h i c .
    BEC PURSER: Ab l el a d ha ' e f he a i g I had i he alk
    ab he b a di g ce a d bei g a h bei g a l f e i al
    lab .
    STEVE BATY: I hi k c -de ig a a ac ice ha a g ea e elia ce a
    ha ed ace f l e abili ha he e h d d , he e e ai ai
    a bjec i e di a ce a lea a e ai ai a bjec i e di a ce
    f he e ea ch bjec . B ha all g e he e f f ll hi
    ki d f e h d.
    BEC PURSER: Ab l el , e a d a ic la l he ' e d i g he
    a al i he e e aki g i h he a ici a , a ell. I ' a e a
    le el f e i i i .
    STEVE BATY: Ye . Whe e a e i e e i g ha e' e ee , ha ca
    be - a d e' e d i g ha i h he a d a ic la l f i h
    a ici a e ha di i c i - h e i i e d eed be
    ha i e e a i ? The e ial f j dg e , he e ial f

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  16. N e ha hi i a edi ed a c i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i
    i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be
    c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i .
    Page 95
    defe i e e i ha e e aki g ac i i ?
    BEC PURSER: Oh, ab l el . I hi k i a he I a d i g
    Ma e ' jec I a ki g i h AIM hich i a I dige e i g
    ga i a i . A he a e i e I a ki g i i a ce a d d i g
    e ea ch f k a d d i g e ea ch f Ma e ' g a a - i e.
    I eall ck e he diffe e a ha I ke ab a ici a
    bef e I a ed he jec , bef e I a ed g i g h gh ha ce I
    ld f e c e f e ea ch a d a , "The aid he did e ea ch,
    b he d ' eall k ha e ea ch i ." Thi i e, b i '
    i i ed i a e j dg e al a , ha I' a i g ha he a ici a
    d e ' de a d. Al he ble i i h he , a d i a a a i g
    h ha la g age a d e ec i e f i cha ged he I a ki g
    i h AIM a d I a e ea chi g a e ee h had bee h gh he
    g a . Pa f ha ce f ki g i h Fi Na i e le i I
    ga e he a i ha e all f e ea ch e a d ec di g
    a ell a a c f he fi al . N e e b d k e ha ,
    b f a ici a did a d i eall ade e hi k ab h I i e
    e a d h I ell he e e le' ie i a e e ec f l fa hi . S
    af e ha , I ed c i g f e ea ch i e ie i h i a ce
    a ici a a i g ha he did ' de a d h e ea ch a d
    a ed alki g ab h d c e e he ble .
    STEVE BATY: Y ade e i he e f he a i hich he e ea ch
    i e e ed. D e ha cha ge? D e a ge i g he e le i h li ed
    e e ie ce he el e ell hei ie e i akeh lde ?
    Af e he a al i a d he he i i d e, d ha e he e e
    hei a al i ?

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  17. N e ha hi i a edi ed a c i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i
    i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be
    c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i .
    Page 96
    BEC PURSER: I ha e ' d e ha i he a f c -de ig jec , b I
    ha e d e i i he a f jec he e e' e bee d ci g
    e a , f e a le, he e e' e lled a ici a f he
    e ea ch l. Hea i g i f e e' ice i ch a e
    diffe e ce. Whe he ca d ha f a ide ec di g i h he
    ha i g he ac all i he ca be h gel i ac f l. Y j eed
    be ca ef l ha - I hi k i a a diffe e e e e h alked ab
    h e le ill ick e e e ie ce, e hi g ha e a ici a aid
    a d he ill i h i .
    STEVE BATY: Ye .
    BEC PURSER: I g e i ha be c a ed e ell.
    STEVE BATY: Ye . I' e all c ci f ha Ka a alki g ab
    i e f he diffe e e f i igh a d he e g h ha ha ca
    ha e i he he a ici a i he e elli g i .
    BEC PURSER: Ye .
    STEVE BATY: S e e he igh i he e g i g, "I al ead k e ha ,"
    a be he e e he i ' ld i h he e i f he e
    h ha bee e e ie ci g i .
    BEC PURSER: Ab l el . The e' f e a e e i i e ha i
    c ica ed i e e a e.
    STEVE BATY: I abel a ked a e i , he ki g a jec he e
    c -de ig c ld ' be ca ied h gh he ce , ill i be

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  18. N e ha hi i a edi ed a c i f a li e e e a d he ef e ma c ai e . Thi a c i
    i he j i e f Ca i LIVE a d he a h i ed a e ible f a me a d ma be
    c ied ed b a he a i h a h i a i .
    Page 97
    al able d hi d i g he i i ial e ea ch ha e la e d i g he
    idea i ha e? I g e if had ch e.
    BEC PURSER: I g e i ld be ha ' he ea h he jec i '
    i able ca ' be ca ied ? I i , a , a i e a c a i ac
    hi g ha e l ed i c -de ig bei g able be ca ied h gh he
    e i e ce ? I ld ce ai l a ha igh i ha ge e i a f he
    jec , igh i ha i i ial di c e ha e i he e he al e f
    high a ici a al e ca be. B i c ld be a jec like blic
    a he e he c le i ake i i able. H e e c ld
    ge i he de ig ha e a d fi d ha he e a e all de ig ble
    i e ac i ha ld be e i able f c -de ig j l e hi
    e hi g. H ge he bike he bike ack he ehicle, f
    e a le.
    STEVE BATY: Ye , e celle . Tha k ch Bec, ha ' bee
    de f l.
    BEC PURSER: Tha k ch, a ell.
    STEVE BATY: Al igh , i i i e f a af e ea b eak. Wha I'd like
    d i e had 30 i e e a ide f af e ea. Le ' ick ha
    30 i e . We'll c e back a 2.50 if ha ' ka , a he ha he
    bli hed 2.55. Tha gi e e lee a i be ee alk la e i he
    da . We'll ake ha cha ge. Take a b eak, ge e f e h ai . Walk
    a a f he c ee . Wha e e eed. Be ead f h e la h ee
    alk . The h ld be h gh f a a e a d he ' e g i g be icel
    ela ed. S ge ead , c e back. 2.50, a d e'll g h gh h e la
    h ee e i f he c fe e ce. Tha k , e e e.

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