strategic objective and creating that kind of culture, and they do that by starting with themselves” “…they realize that ‘hey, if I’m not modeling this culture that I want to create, nothing's going to happen, so got to start there’ ” “…and then I'm going to start with my direct leadership team, and before we announce anything about a big culture change; we're going to start learning how to be that culture and that of course makes them more coherent, more able to lead change, and then people will see they're for real” “…and the people will see the role models and so on and so forth so that makes it a lot easier to bring about working on those cultural aspects that really needed to complement the more systems and structures that are often the primary focus in agile” (Joiner).