A mathematician of this period, given the number 12, could easily see that 4 is a submultiple of it since 3 times 4 is exactly 12. Although to us this is clearly the same as division, it is important to see the distinction. We have used the word "submultiple" above, so should indicate what the Pythagoreans considered this to be. Nicomachus, following the tradition of Pythagoras, makes the following definition of a submultiple:- The submultiple, which is by its nature the smaller, is the number which when compared with the greater can measure it more times than one so as to fill it out exactly. Magnitudes, being distinct entities from numbers, had to have a separate definition and indeed Nicomachus makes such a parallel definition for magnitudes. The idea of Pythagoras that "all is number" is explained by Aristotle in Metaphysics:- [In the time of Pythagoras] since all other things seemed in their whole nature to be modelled on numbers, and numbers seemed to be the first things in the whole of nature, they supposed the elements of numbers to be the elements of all things, and the whole heaven to be a musical scale and a number. And all the properties of numbers and scales which they could show to agree with the attributes and parts and the whole arrangement of the heavens, they fitted into their scheme ... the Pythagoreans say that things are what they are by intimating numbers ... the Pythagoreans take objects themselves to be numbers and do not treat mathematical objects as distinct from them ... This concept certainly ran into difficulties once various magnitudes were studied. All numbers, essentially by definition, were, as we have seen, (positive integer) multiples of a base unit but ratios of lengths were shown not to have the property of being ratios of numbers (integers). The usual example given of this comes from a right angled triangle whose shorter sides are both of unit length. Such a triangle has as hypotenuse a line of length √2 times the lengths of the shorter sides. There is no length x such that 1 and √2 are both multiples (remember integer multiples) of x. Plato, in Theaetetus, tells of the discovery that √3, √5, ... , √17 were not commensurable with 1:- Theodorus was writing out for us something about roots, such as the sides of squares whose area was 3 or 5 units, showing that the sides are incommensurable with the unit: he took the examples up to 17, but there for some reason he stopped.